From Japan, With Changes...

[Saiake]

Hello All

Tis been a while since I posted a major thread here. Normally I'm just hiding in my little corner with Hothead in "Tales of Two Cambions" and posting back and forth in here. However today I fealt like bringing up a topic that really pisses me off in recent times.

Disclaimer: These views are that of a Pervert and a modest Gamer. The views reflected in this are of my Perverted Opinion

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It started a few months back. I saw news that a new "Dead or Alive Xtreme" game was comming out. I was quite excited by that news. The 2nd installment to the series is an admitantly guilty pleasure of mine, and while it's mostly just for oggling bouncy boobies and girls in bikinis, some of the minigames are actually quite fun.

(Spoilerd for Size)

Spoiler: show

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Anyway, it broke my heart to see that Japan will NOT be releasing it out in the west, because according to comments made on social media, and get this...
"They were concerend about how the West percieves the potrayal of Females in videogames"....


Now...I can appreciate the takeing of consideration the views of some of the public in a particular region...but this is Koei Techmo. The Dead or Alive series, while built on a solid fast paced fighter, has always had a certain "Appeal" to certain gamers in their ways with fanservice. For them to now be going out and saying they don't want to cause any "stiring of the waters" is some real crap

But Wait, There's More.

More Recently my roommate Ace (Pokemonaces) has gotten me into "Xenoblade Chronicles X". Its alot of fun and while I'm not as far along as Ace, the world is huge and their so much to do and explore. Anyway, a small feature of the game is different gear to put on your characters for stats n appearances n what not, nothing strange here. Some of the costume choices can also show off Alot of skin, something we've all come to expect from Japan.

That is...except for one of the characters. The young girl Lin Lee Koo. A young Mechanic in the game who's official Age is only 13 years old.
(Again, Spoilerd for size)

Spoiler: show

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Now, while she "Can" wear the bikinis, skimpy armors and the like. Many of of the more revealing costumes have been augmented on her to cover up more of her skin in the western releases. Further more I found on further research that their was once a "Breast size" Slider for the female custom characters in Japan, but was removed for the western release...


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Theirs Alot more good Games out their that have been Censored or altered in one way or another for the sake of Western release. Xenoblade, Fatal frame, Bravley Default, the list goes on, but I wanted to get that slightly ranty bit out of my system and find out what others thought of these changes. Personally i think it boils down yo cultrual barriers. Whats ment to be cheeky amd humorous in japanese culture comes of as creepy and eromg in others eyes. Though if you are made to change it to appeal to others, in a way you are changing art. And that their is a Damned Crying shame.

Well, I'll be slithering off to my corner again, so tell me what you all think.

[Father Rodin]

I'm more upset by the breast slider removal and the fundoshi being changed than by Lin (who, aside from being unappealing to me, is a brat and thus I want to see as little of her as possible - those who reached chapter 11 will know why). I'm not a loli or pettanko lover, but I do have fun making improbably-sized characters whenever possible, and the breast slider had some fun possibilities with making 'how does she even stand upright' characters. :V

But yeah, this political correctness is trash. Best part is the perpetually offended are now upset because the UK censored Steven Universe's release over there... by removing lesbians. Which, let's be honest, are just as controversial. But apparently, they only care about censorship when it strikes THEIR interests. >_>

[Blake81]

Heh, you know what's funny? While here in the west the localizing companies make sure every imported game gets thoroughly censored of anything that might be ''dangerous to its audience'' and think that makes them more ''audience friendly'', according to many Japanese ppl I know, the image they have of the Americans (the Europeans are safe from this) is that they are all ''Sexually Repressed People'' or to quote their exact words ''they're closet perverts''; they have all these gigantic industry of uncensored porn, that makes millions per year, and yet they keep all of this hidden under the covers of absolute moral correctness and keep acting as if sex and sexuality were something shameful.

This is also, however, the main reason of why of every 10 games released in japan, we barely see 4 over here. Why? Because not only the game developers CAN'T DO THEIR OWN TRANSLATIONS (the excuse of why is ''Quality Control''), but they actually have TO PAY (and it's no small sum) the guys who do the localization whenever the game they want released in the west has ''inappropriate content'' to have this content removed. And this has been like that since the NES era, and not only it's the censorship in terms of skimpy outfits and bouncing boobs, this goes as far as removing any sex-related joke, comment or anything similar by altering the translation.

Usually, the best way to see this is to compare between the US and EU versions of the game (which can be easily seen in old ROMS), you'll notice that, in most cases, the US versions cut out or watered down anything remotely sexual or inappropriate (except in cases where it was so pivotal to the story that they simply couldn't remove it, like Lezard being a lolicon on the first Valkyrie Profile.) but leave all the gory violence aplenty, in the EU ones, however, you'll notice that some of the violence has been toned down (or maybe the game was given a higher ESRB rating) while all the sexual stuff, non-explicit sex scenes and even NUDES have been left untouched.

Still, this has been changing a bit in these late years, but never because the localizers became more lax, but because the Japanese companies have found alternate ways to get their games here, namely Steam.

Although many games still fall victim to the ''Censorshit'', Steam has allowed many Japanese companies to localize the game by their own means or given them the liberty to choose what localizer they employ. Of course, Steam still doesn't allow H-Games to retain their H, but that's the only part they remove, and based on what I've heard from many ppl, they do it seamlessly. NekoPara is a good example of this; an Japanese H-Game brought to the west, fully officially translated by its developers, and which Steam released only sans the H-scenes. Still, if you bought the genuine game, DL the H version and replace the Steam Game's files with the H ones, not only you can still play the game on Steam, but rumor is that there's a ''secret achievement'' called quite simply ''Hentai'' that you get if you play the H version using Steam (seem they can detect it, but do nothing about it). Also, most non-H Japanese VNs you find on Steam show no censorship or any kind (unless it was localized by some 3rd party outside Steam and the original Dev), and this isn't only for Japanese games; many European-made games (Like Deponia and Two Worlds 2) which came with nudes or similar sexual stuff remained untouched.

However, big games like Xenoblade Chronicles are almost always localized by 3rd parties, usually whatever Publisher they have a contract with. Those guys are always censor-happy (Ubisoft is the worst of them...), and sadly, the version of the game you get at Steam already went through their knives and scissors...

[Father Rodin]

Xenoblade's misfortune was being localized by 8-4 which is a team with notorious heavy Social Justice Warrior ties - just look at the atrocious hatchet job done with Gunvolt's translation or the mess that Mighty N.9 is turning out to be. The moment I heard they were involved in the localization I knew any hopes of it remaining untouched were doomed.

And that's overlooking the plot point about the White Whale's crew, which makes the whole 'well she's 13' excuse for Lin moot - those who played to chapter 5 know what I'm talking about.

[Feathers]

Lucky Play Asia came to the rescue for the people that want the DOA game (not enough feathers for me though). Personally I'm re-hyping over the next Moe Chronicle since you can have an ending with the Monster Girl of your choice (the Siren!).

[Father Rodin]

Lucky Play Asia came to the rescue for the people that want the DOA game (not enough feathers for me though)

Uh. Nyotengu? She IS a tengu, you know...

[Feathers]

You do know that they removed Nyotengu's wings in the new DOA game, yes? She's just a regular human...

Also, Fire Emblem removed the cute little petting game with your husbando/waifu.

[youtube]KvYrkKrGPR4[/youtube]

/Boycott activate!!!!! Really disappointed in this video game censorship.

[kukuruyo]

It started way before DoaX, and some of us had been warning about it for some time. We are now just watching the results of something that started when Anita sarkeesian began her series of calling every game in existance "sexist".

Now japanese developers are so afraid of the ambient of fear she and her kind have created, that we can see news of games being censored (or not released) every week.

And it's only the begining. In france they already tried to pass a law to censor games with "sexist" content. Expect more of this and hope this wave of political correctness fade without leaving behind abusive laws.

[Kaijin]

Also, Fire Emblem removed the cute little petting game with your husbando/waifu.

And the Japanese voice acting along with it... (And if it's like it was on Awakening it will be way better than the English one... Heck English Awakening's invented lines because of... yeah)
This is just great... First they force people to pay three times the price of a normal game to "enjoy" the full game, now they literally disregard and downright insult the western comunity as a whole by giving them an INCOMPLETE and POINTLESSLY CENSORED product with an abusive price.

And the worst of it all? That they fully know that they can pull off any kind of crap they want and still countless people will fall into line because it's done on a region locked console.

[kukuruyo]

A video showing how they erased entire conversations



Some of the censorship they did:



And more stuff http://thegg.net/opinion-editorial/did- ... wards-yes/

[Perentie]

Not being able to touch them (and from what I've seen it wasn't all that interactive when you could) is a small loss to me since we still have the gorgeous talking faces, and most of the voice actors seem passable (though perhaps I am too forgiving there). I do admit Effie's voice is offputting, so good to know she was originally meant to sound different.

I'm mostly glad that the actual character designs were not altered/censored, I am only halfway through the first two game routes and I believe I am developing a unhealthy obsession with Camilla.

The limited availability of the special edition is the worst thing to me, I've never paid so much for a game in my life. I think I can say it is worth it to own the complete game on one cartridge, but that is only because I happened to have enough money put away to get it.

[Kaijin]

(though perhaps I am too forgiving there)

Most likely being ignorant (no offense here).
Since you can't listen Japanese voice acting you can't compare it to the English one, and thus you compel yourself to think "hey, this is actually not bad" because you're forced to listen to it no matter what.

Anyway, this is way beyond offensive... the way BOTH Nintendo AND Intelligent Systems are treating the whole western community is downright sickening.

[Blake81]

Since you can't listen Japanese voice acting you can't compare it to the English one, and thus you compel yourself to think "hey, this is actually not bad" because you're forced to listen to it no matter what.

Yes, this is a common happening.

Sometimes, the Eng dub IS well done enough for you to like it, yet only when you listen to the Original Jap Voiceover you realize how much stuff they messed up or was cut out.

For me, the best example of this is Unchained Blades; while its Eng dub didn't seem half bad, once I heard the japanese one, I realized that this game had taken the ''Censcissor'' to many uncomfortable places.

For instance, the opening, which was goddamn epic song in the original Jap version, in the eng dub, it got the song replaced by the standard battle BGM! And don't even get me started on all of Sylvie's conversations with her brother, where ''Onii-sama'' was translated ''My Lord'' (seriously!). But the worst part of all was what they did to Tiana's dialogue; in the original version, she was a brash girl, with a hotheaded and impulsive attitude (and voiced by the peerless Koshimizu Ami), but apparently, the Eng Dub guys decided she wasn't ''Princess-y Enough'' so they decided to make all of her dialogue like she was some goddamn Disney princess...

This was simply unforgivable...!

[Perentie]

Most likely being ignorant (no offense here).
Since you can't listen Japanese voice acting you can't compare it to the English one, and thus you compel yourself to think "hey, this is actually not bad" because you're forced to listen to it no matter what.

I have listened to various parts in Japanese online, but I've always found it difficult to compare the quality of Japanese and English voice acting even with subtitles for the former.

[Kaijin]

where ''Onii-sama'' was translated ''My Lord'' (seriously!)

Be thankful that it wasn't translated as "Bro"...XD

As for the rest of your exposition, those are pretty much examples I've seen plenty of times (sadly)... I'll give you a couple of Fire Emblem Awakening examples:

-In one of Henry and Olivia's convos Henry actually cried due to the thought of our cute androphobic dancer could end up dying, the NA (and by extension the EU too) version scraps that completely.
-In the Japanese version Tharja was referred as the girl with nicest body, in the overseas versions changed that to the girl with the "darkest thoughts".
-Lissa's line when you hit S rank.

JAP: "I love you. You've made me so happy by giving me this ring. From now on, let's always stay happy together"
NA/EU: "“Oh my gosh, this ring is HUGE! Ohh... we're gonna have such a GREAT life together!”

(Yep... They turned the sweetest gal in the whole game into a friggin' gold digger)
.P.S.:

I have listened to various parts in Japanese online, but I've always found it difficult to compare the quality of Japanese and English voice acting even with subtitles for the former.

You need no subtitles to see when a voice acting is good or not... And I'm not only talking about translations here, things like the entonation, correct use of pauses, the passion put into it... can be noticed regardless if you understand or not.
Maybe it's not that you can't compare them, but to put it bluntly you just don't care about voice acting at all.

[Perentie]

Maybe it's not that you can't compare them, but to put it bluntly you just don't care about voice acting at all.

I like the pokemon dub well enough so I guess some might say that. Basically I've always been pretty lenient on voice acting (perhaps because my own voice doesn't sound all that good to me), it has to be really, really bad to bother me. Story line accuracy is a bigger deal to me than voice acting when it comes to dubs.

I do wonder though why the Japanese audio wasn't included this time, seems like including it is something most major dubs do these days and its a good compromise for those that can't stand the dubs.

[kukuruyo]

More stuff.



and more

http://www.gamezone.com/originals/the-f ... rible-jz1p

[Perentie]

That one can probably be blamed on people who find it offensive if a same sex relationship is treated any different from a straight one, who might think the idea of her wishing she was a man be the same as if she was saying there was something wrong with being a woman, etc. I doubt there was any winning there though, people would be angry regardless.

[Feathers]

Also, Fire Emblem removed the cute little petting game with your husbando/waifu.

And the Japanese voice acting along with it... (And if it's like it was on Awakening it will be way better than the English one... Heck English Awakening's invented lines because of... yeah)
This is just great... First they force people to pay three times the price of a normal game to "enjoy" the full game, now they literally disregard and downright insult the western comunity as a whole by giving them an INCOMPLETE and POINTLESSLY CENSORED product with an abusive price.

And the worst of it all? That they fully know that they can pull off any kind of crap they want and still countless people will fall into line because it's done on a region locked console.

Friend bought me the game so I have played it. I really miss Japanese audio option. It didn't hook me like Awakening did. It feels basically just like Awakening. The terrible stat gains still force resets or risk characters being useless or weak. Especially a factor for me since I'm playing on Hard/Classic. I like how they added some new classes though. Especially the Kinshi Knight. Story is basic on Birthright, which I have, but I heard Conq is more fun. If I get that for free I'll try it too..

I heard the skinship was mainly removed because of suggestive voice overs. I guess they rather remove them entirely instead of "toning it down". Meh.

[Kaijin]

The terrible stat gains still force resets or risk characters being useless or weak.

Actually that's a trademark trait in the whole series.
The level up stat gains in the Fire Emblem series are decided by RNG, I guess Intelligent Systems keeps using said method in order to make all games/saves/characters unique and giving all characters the chance of being remotely useful (heck that even manages to make the "Jeigan archetype characters" like Frederick, Seth or Camilla worth giving a chance to shine...specially on harder difficulties).

But yeah, I agree that getting empty level ups is a major pain in the rear.

.P.S.:

but I heard Conq is more fun. If I get that for free I'll try it too..

If you like classic Fire Emblems maybe it would be worth giving it a chance.
While Birthright uses the Awakening's gameplay (which in turn uses Sacred Stones' gameplay), Conquest uses the classic system instead: Which basically means no world map exploration (you're forced to move through chapters and that's it) and no chances of grinding outside of story battles (be it levels/classes/abilities or support levels).
It could be more challenging and fun to play (If I ever get this game... which is quite unlikely thanks to Nintendo, Intelligent Systems AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST Treehouse's abusive and disrespectful treatment to the whole Western gaming community) I'd get Conquest (I like the classic system more as I grew up with it)), but be warned it's way more unforgiving as well.